Custom sunset/sunruse schedule - default is not OK for me.


  • f.lux team

    @Jacob-Johnston For now it is. You can see the difference between Twilight and f.lux here: https://fluxometer.com/rainbow/#!id=Nexus 4 Apps/flux1900-nexus4



  • @lorna

    That's a neat visualization but I'm not sure but I'm not sure what to make of the results or the numbers. It's comparing f.lux1900 to twillight1500 (not sure what this means) and in my experience with twillight on my Galaxy Note4 you can set the color temp and dimming separately, with color temp ranging way further into the reds than I would usually use... I'll think about rooting my phone. I could provide more detailed feedback than I probably should in this forum but at the momet I just have no other good reason to root my phone.



  • @Jacob-Johnston The fluxometer compares the DEFAULT settings in twilight. So when you first install it, it's not doing SHIT to reduce much of the blue or green colors, by just using a red overlay. Yes you can change it around to 2700K but it's fading out the text and it's not as comfortable to read.

    Filters like this are terrible, but that's all that is currently allowed without having root access. I hope color temp changes are allowed as regular users in the future.


  • f.lux team

    @Jacob-Johnston The TL;DR is that dimming your phone and holding it further from your face is the best solution we know of for non-rooted phones right now.



  • I would love to beta flux on my android devices, I have a phone and a tablet running 4.4.x and a tablet running 4.2.x and one other tablet running 5.0.



  • I'm really looking forward to the new PC version!

    * SPOILER ALERT - Long Post *

    I've worked on both small & large teams...

    /Generalization ON
    If properly managed, large(r) teams can iterate versions quickly...until they're too large (or not quite large enough, in the case of rapid growth), and then teams either have to be divided up...or (if management can't get their act together), pray the company gets purchased before the business closes. Furthermore, big team politics can often kill teamwork, and make your job a nice place to get away from as quickly as possible at the end of the day - which can lead to inferior product.

    Small teams are more constrained by hours in the day & quantity of hands to do things. But if dedicated, they make superior product (like L&M's f.lux team!), but unless they have nothing else to do (often also a company killer), things can take a bit longer.
    /Generalization OFF

    f.lux UI, functionality, & your depth of research all deserve high praise!

    Before my father recommended f.lux to me last fall, I've had to resort to many kludgy work-arounds for years to manage lighting so that my challenges with SAD/dysthymia/bipolar don't render me totaly useless. Full sized homemade full spectrum flourescent light boxes get the strangest of looks from people who don't know what's going on!

    They got even more confused when they'd turn my overhead light on towards evening and I'd ask them to turn it off again.

     "You use that light box all day long, 
      and then you turn off the light at night 
      when you need it...I don't get it!"
    

    It's interesting that they really enjoyed hanging out in my space during rainy days when I had the only available "sun" light!

    I have several systems:
       - Win10 Convertible Laptop/Tablet
       - Android Tablet
       - MacBook
       - Vista laptop (soon either Win10 - else Linux)
    . . . Desktop PC's of various vintage lurking in dark storage corners!

    Beta testing is something I'd be interested in - especially for something which assists better health & outlook on life.

    Here's my take on the Quick-Set Buttons discussion . . .


    In SETTINGS screen:

    1. Provide user checkbox to switch from AUTOMATED SCHEDULE to MANUAL input;
    2. In MANUAL settings, provide slider (suggest 1 - 4 only) to select User-desired quantity of settings to be memorized;

    In MANUAL settings:

    1. User selects a numbered radio button to "program";

    Using a choice of:
       - Provided f.lux presets; or,
       - The existing LOCATION; or,
       - Day Time/Night Time colour sliders

    1. User makes desired lighting adjustments;

    2. User presses "MEMORIZE" button in MANUAL settings screen;
      (Behind the scenes, CURRENT SETTINGS are applied to the selected radio button.)
      6) User repeats steps 3 through 5 as required;

    3. Return to regularly scheduled programming;

    4. When desired/needed User selects radio button(s) to manually switch to (now memorized) settings for each radio button;

    5. Manual tweakers are now (maybe) happier. (Are we ever?)

    You could have all settings allocated to either manual or scheduled, with the caveat that any manual selection will override a current schedule. (But this would require more programming than the suggestion above & would likely confuse less technical Users.)

    Perhaps an option to set the number of DESIRED DAYLIGHT HOURS (originally defaulted to LOCATION), after which the automated schedule could proceed as usual? (This would be simplest, but wouldn't provide the level of control for manual tweakers.)

    And of course:

    1. A RESET BUTTON to undo all of the damage wrought by the tweakers!

    Though I LOVE f.lux and would continue to use it in its present condition, I will (almost always) welcome intelligent changes to the interface and options!

    Keep up the good work!



  • It's really embarrassing that the dev talks about an "upcoming version" for 6 months for a feature so simple that can be fixed with the Task Scheduler, PR much? Anyway thanks a bunch to Jari Kolehmainen for the tip on how to properly close the app from the Task Scheduler.



  • @Cat-Cat said:

    It's really embarrassing that the dev talks about an "upcoming version" for 6 months for a feature so simple that can be fixed with the Task Scheduler, PR much? Anyway thanks a bunch to Jari Kolehmainen for the tip on how to properly close the app from the Task Scheduler.

    He's not developing for one feature, Cat Cat. He's developing for much more than that, and he's also trying to support multiple operating systems and multiple platforms. He is also doing this voluntarily, FOR FREE. He is also doing this as time permits because he has a personal life to attend to as well.

    So please be more understanding and forgiving.



  • I appreciate the work!

    Want to throw my hat in on custom schedules. Sunrise/sunset does not work for me either.
    An alternate better approach for me would be sleep schedule. I go to sleep between 11 and midnight regardless of sunset.
    I only need the dimming to start at 9 and slow dim until midnight. (3 hours dim length)

    I also have different wake up schedules depending on workday(real early to the gym on some days) and sleep in on weekends.
    Daily specific/weekly schedules would be useful for me. Any ETA on when something like this might make it into a beta?

    Thx



  • I'd like to add my support for a custom schedule, as well as request access to the beta. I'm pretty far up north, and the length of our days varies greatly depending on the season. My work schedule, however, doesn't.



  • @CobraA1 said:

    My work schedule, however, doesn't.

    Maybe it should, robot workers aren't here yet, so maybe work schedules should work a bit more with the seasons.



  • @lorna said:

    Thanks for letting us know about your schedule and your feature request.

    Irregular and non-24 schedules are definitely harder to handle so it's helpful to hear what you need.

    This topic is the most viewed on this forum with 12k views, so obviously a lot of people would like to set a custom schedule. It could be implemented very easily: just give user two sliders to specify start and end of nighttime. It can't surely be very difficult, please give us an update.


  • f.lux team

    @stonec It does seem very simple doesn't it? But we are trying to make something that helps people understand both the science and their body's own needs, and that isn't simple at all. Our focus has always been to do no harm with our products, and that means we take our time to get things right.

    It is frustrating to wait, I know. We hope you will love the next release that's coming out.



  • @lorna could you add a bit more detail about this please? Such as, are there limits to how long the user can set f.lux to be in a daytime mode / night time mode? I can't think of any other important parameters, but I'm sure you've thought of a lot more details.



  • @emphatico said:

    Before my father recommended f.lux to me last fall, I've had to resort to many kludgy work-arounds for years to manage lighting so that my challenges with SAD/dysthymia/bipolar don't render me totaly useless. Full sized homemade full spectrum flourescent light boxes get the strangest of looks from people who don't know what's going on!

    They got even more confused when they'd turn my overhead light on towards evening and I'd ask them to turn it off again.

     "You use that light box all day long, 
      and then you turn off the light at night 
      when you need it...I don't get it!"
    

    It's interesting that they really enjoyed hanging out in my space during rainy days when I had the only available "sun" light!

    Have four / five lamps connected to a powerstrip (AND ONLY) lamps connected to said power strip, and plug in a lamp dimmer to that. Then with a sliding button, you can have nice sunset style lighting. When the sun sets, it's closer to the horizon, compared to overhead noon. I think once people see how many lights are connected, they'll be fine with using the lamps.

    Product recommendation, Lutron lamp dimmers. They have a version that plugs into the wall outlet! It's very easy to use.

    Edit: Oh and get an LED based light box, the fuller spectrum of light will certainly help, and colors will be slightly better.



  • @lorna said:

    @stonec It does seem very simple doesn't it? But we are trying to make something that helps people understand both the science and their body's own needs, and that isn't simple at all. Our focus has always been to do no harm with our products, and that means we take our time to get things right.

    It is frustrating to wait, I know. We hope you will love the next release that's coming out.

    I understand the need to keep things intuitive and simple. I live in Finland where in midsummer the sun goes barely down at all, between sunset and sunrise is less than 3 hours, but I need my monitor to stay in night mode before I go to sleep. The only way to achieve this with current app is to put in a fake time zone, which is not intuitive.

    Anyway I have time to wait, just something simple for defining custom night times for next version would be cool and much needed.



  • @Tungsten_smooth said:

    @CobraA1 said:

    My work schedule, however, doesn't.

    Maybe it should, robot workers aren't here yet, so maybe work schedules should work a bit more with the seasons.

    Well, robot workers aren't everywhere yet. One of my grandparents used to bemoan how many factories went to robots (I think he lost his job to automation).

    In any case, back on topic. It sounds nice, but is very unlikely to ever happen. I can't control how my workplace schedules the day, so I might as well adapt to it. Not to mention it's second shift, so it's an evening shift anyways, and I know people who work on the third (overnight) shift.

    Point being - I don't have full control over my schedule. So having something I can adapt to my schedule would be beneficial.

    But we are trying to make something that helps people understand both the science and their body's own needs

    I just want something that changes the color of my monitor at scheduled times, though :/.



  • aahh midnight sun in north sweden ;). Sorry but I can only use Flux like 4 month a year and thats really sux because its a really good Product those 4 month. Please fix the problem, please!



  • I love f.lux and I think you've done a great job with it. I do however really wish there will be a feature for custom sunset/sunrise timers. I live in Norway and go to bed at roughly 11 pm every night on weekdays because of work schedule. In the winter f.lux sunset kicks in 5 hours too early, and in the summer 1-2 hours too late. I set my timezone to Paris which seems to work ok with my sleep schedule, but I'd rather have custom timers.



  • I have to agree with the consensus here - a custom timer would be amazing. I currently have Twilight running on my phone and love the ability to set when I want it to begin and end. I'm just getting into astronomy and white light is bad, as you probably already know. It would be very nice to have the ability to set our own hours so we can have the screen dimmed before it's dark enough for viewing.

    I have to agree with CobraA1 about having something to manually set times. I realize it's important (engineering major) for people to learn how something works and why it works, but a majority of the population just simply don't care. I mean that with no offense, it's just the way I see it.

    How do I get in on the beta?!



  • @tugger said:

    I'm just getting into astronomy and white light is bad

    Are you familiar with the effects of light pollution? The International Dark Sky association is a great resource. Star light and room lights are very closely related. Street lights can disrupt sleep too!

    How do I get in on the beta?!

    You can find the program in the play store with the following link: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.justgetflux.flux



  • @Tungsten_smooth said:

    @tugger said:

    I'm just getting into astronomy and white light is bad

    Are you familiar with the effects of light pollution? The International Dark Sky association is a great resource. Star light and room lights are very closely related. Street lights can disrupt sleep too!

    How do I get in on the beta?!

    You can find the program in the play store with the following link: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.justgetflux.flux

    Yes, I'm vaguely familiar with the street lights and that stuff. I use my laptop for observing and have to mess with f.lux before I'm at the site so white light doesn't appear.

    I was referring to the Windows beta - I thought that's what they were referring too.



  • We were indeed referring to a Beta version of f.lux for Windows, but we have to keep in mind that the f.lux team consists of just two people. They are a husband and wife team, and they aren't being paid to do this. They are true volunteers. They have very busy lives, so it could be a while before we see a beta. They can only do so much on any given day.

    I think we will all know when they have a Beta version that we can all try.


  • f.lux team

    @TwoCables one of the things keeping us so busy is the upcoming Windows beta!



  • @lorna said:

    @TwoCables one of the things keeping us so busy is the upcoming Windows beta!

    Oh nice. Thank you for all you do.



  • @lorna Glad to read it! Hey when you get done with that, and you're not too busy with the Android stuff, I think Ubuntu snap files will help you a lot with Linux (I made a post about it). That should make it work on almost every Linux distribution.



  • Hey @lorna,

    Thanks for working on f.lux. It is one of my most beloved piece of software.
    Is there any news for the upcoming Windows beta?
    I'd be quite interested in participating.

    Background:
    I'm finding myself more and more micro-managing f.lux, especially during the winter when the sun goes down so early around this part of the globe. And so I am looking more and more for ways I could keep that automatic: e.g. set warming to happen from 9:30pm till 10:30pm and cooling to happen from 7:30am till 8:30am.



  • This program is basically unusable for me without being able to set when day and night start. The excuse of trying to "educate" people about their sleep needs or whatever... that just seems quite mental to me. it's almost saying "we know what you want better than you know what you want!"

    I mean, if it actually worked that would be one thing but it doesn't even work for the standard use case ime. I'm here in england with a good 45 minutes of daylight/twilight left. WELL before sunset. And it thinks the sun set 20 minutes ago.

    So please add the ability to manually override the day and night triggers. PLEASE.


  • f.lux team

    @jimjamjahaa I can respect that, the sunset timing is not the right thing for everyone. The thing is, "what's best" for lighting is a pretty active ongoing research topic. So our goal is not to know what's better for people than they do, but to actively find ways for you to figure out what's better for you. I really hope you'll try again with the next update to our Windows version.



  • @lorna Sorry if this is the wrong place to ask this but I work in special education in the field of assistive technology and we want to set the screen brightness much lower and then just keep i that way. Is Flux the way to do that? Can it be just set at a brightness value and then just left there with no change due to time of day?



  • @lorna hey thanks for the quick reply. yeah, i'll check out the new release for sure :) sorry for being grumpy. you guys put your work out there for free and we just complain :/


  • f.lux team

    @ATCnorthstar Like with dimming or with a color shift?



  • For everyone watching and waiting, like I have.....Forever..... For such a simple request, yes it is quite simple(Im a 10 year software's engineer) your wait should be over soon as the creators update for Windows 10 coming in a couple months is reported to have this feature baked into the OS, f.lux unfortunately missed the opportunity to be the market leader by being slow or in this case totally unresponsive to user needs. I feel sad for f.lux team as they could have dominated the market here by being more mature and feature rich and building brand loyalty amongst it's user base, their inability to do so has relegated them to just a footnote in this space. 😢

    You should see reports from on this feature from Windows insider preview builds I imagine fairly soon.


  • f.lux team

    Thanks @jimjamjahaa, no worries. It's a fair request. Our goal is to further the understanding of human biology, not just turn things orange on a timer. It's a longer term undertaking and a much more difficult one.



  • @archalien Oh wow I didn't know it's in my OS haha. The Creator update is finally here and yes, the Night light setting is great - everything f.lux could have been. I'm amazed that this feature was requested since 2015 and even now was not implemented.



  • @lonelymoon The developer clearly doesn't care, and is never going to make another update. What's more amazing is how they kept lying to us for years that it's "right around the corner" and "we just need to understand human biology first". If they had just been honest and told us that it wasn't going to be made, then at least everyone could start looking for other alternatives.


  • f.lux team



  • @lonelymoon I like the Creator's update - it has the schedule, it doesn't interfere with nVidia settings, and it works with more of my games. I think f.lux really passed up a good opportunity - I doubt I will look at it ever again. All I wanted was that scheduling option.



  • @herf thanks, but no thanks. The creators update is out now and finally I don't need f.lux anymore. It was literally less than 50 lines of code to implement a feature that everyone wanted, and it was promised for two years. Surely it was possible to release this basic function without adding all that other stuff that's currently in the beta. But giving users what they wanted clearly wasn't on the list of priorities here.


  • f.lux team

    @joankim Sorry that we disappointed you I wish you well.



  • @lorna Hi. This would have been really great to know 2 years ago! Forcing people into schedules they don't want without explaining why you're doing that is not a very good way to "further the understanding" of anything except frustration. If education really is your goal, you could try adding some explanation on your homepage. : )



  • Any of this discussion would be pointless IF:
    There is manual schedule, in simplest form - start (hour:min , kelvin) , end (hour:min, kelvin).

    Simple.



  • @archalien said in Custom sunset/sunruse schedule - default is not OK for me.:

    For everyone watching and waiting, like I have.....Forever..... For such a simple request, yes it is quite simple(Im a 10 year software's engineer) your wait should be over soon as the creators update for Windows 10 coming in a couple months is reported to have this feature baked into the OS, f.lux unfortunately missed the opportunity to be the market leader by being slow or in this case totally unresponsive to user needs. I feel sad for f.lux team as they could have dominated the market here by being more mature and feature rich and building brand loyalty amongst it's user base, their inability to do so has relegated them to just a footnote in this space. 😢

    You should see reports from on this feature from Windows insider preview builds I imagine fairly soon.

    Is this feature out yet? How do you set it up?



  • This thread is really sad. I keep seeing responses about "wanting to learn more about human physiology", but the team seems completely ignorant to people living close to the arctic circle. I have to turn flux on and off myself, because it's not OK for me to get "ready for bed" at 4 pm. You guys with your quest to learn more about human physiology should've figured out that this kind of behavior can cause further disruptions to the circadian rhythm and contribute to Seasonal Affective Disorder. I want to get blased by blue light until I'm ready to get sleepy. That is not at 4 pm..

    If you guys have a git repo, give me read access, and I'll literally send you a pull request for the suggestion here. Free of charge.



  • Oh FFS! I thought F.lux was wonderful, finally a way to tone down my obnoxiously bright laptop screen at night which is too bright and blue even with the brightness turned all the way down. I spent a good deal of time trying to find a way to set a simple manual timer, I mean it HAS to be there right? I must be really dumb not being able to find it, no way they'd leave out such an obvious and necessary feature? Then I find this thread and see the developer having a douchy, arrogant holier-than-thou attitude and simply refusing to give users a manual setting if they desire to use it? Look I know developing is a lot of work, I'm a developer myself, and I appreciate the effort that has gone into f.lux but this attitude is ridiculous. Adapt my schedule to fit what the software developers think is best for me? I think not, I expect software to adapt to MY needs, not the other way around.

    So I'm tired of fighting with f.lux and hitting disable for an hour repeatedly like one might keep hitting the snooze button on an alarm clock so I'm uninstalling it now and will look for a similar tool that will bend to my needs rather than the other way around. It's disappointing, f.lux has so much potential, it's almost perfect save for one very serious fatal flaw.


  • f.lux team

    @james_s We've been giving f.lux away since 2008 for free. Some of the comments we get from users make it all worthwhile. I regret to say that your comment doesn't fall into that category.

    Nevertheless I appreciate you took the time to write to us. Future versions of f.lux will be more customizable, and I hope you'll try it again in the future. For now, there are plenty of clones (even built into the OS) who offer manual timers, and hopefully one of them will offer the features that you are looking for.

    (closing this poor tired two year old zombie thread)


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